Artist Steve Gorman - The Black Crowes 

Interviewed on 4/19/2001 by Chris 

The Black Crowes are a band that has long bucked the
trends of traditional musicianship and the music
business as a whole. They've really done things their
own way since their inception over a decade ago. For
the most part, they have done things their own way,
and it has worked. They have found success even though
they purposely went out of their way to not record
singles to meet record company expectations, attacked
corporate sponsors of major tours they were on, and
basically lived their own way and did their own thing.
Throughout doing their own thing, they have found true
success over the last two years. They teamed with
superstar Jimmy Page to go on what was their biggest
US tour to date. Further, they released recordings of
these shows on the Internet, and their LIVE AT THE
GREEK went on to be the biggest Internet release in
history. The record then got picked up and distributed
by TVT Records while they worked on their latest
release. Now, LIONS is done, they have a new
supportive label behind them, and they are set to turn
it up again as only they do. We had a chance to
converse with Crowes drummer Steve Gorman recently
about things, and here is what he had to say.

As a die hard fan, I found this to be a very different
sounding record, especially the single, "Lickin'."
Were you going for something a little bit different
this time?

STEVE GORMAN (SG) - I don't think so. We think there's
different stuff every time out. We have a new record
company that isn't stuck in the mentality of what a
single is supposed to sound like. I think that, if
anything, in the past we've always had control of the
albums that we wanted to make. As far as picking
singles, that's always been a struggle. What we here
as a single is rarely what someone at a record company
hears as a single. They are always going for the
lowest common denominator. They want to hear something
that sounds like The Black Crowes, whatever that
means. To us, this is our 6th album. We are all over
the map. If you put our songs in alphabetical order
and listened to them, I think people would be like,
"wow, this is going in all different directions."
We've never really held ourselves back on that. We
like to do straight rock songs. We like to do songs
that have more funk stuff. There's stuff that we've
always liked to do, but it always seems like when it
comes time to picking the single, someone is like,
"let's just get the straight rock song," every time.
We've never liked that. We've fought that and bitched
and complained, and we've never been willing to play
ball with the record company in the studio. If you are
not going to play ball with the record company, they
don't care what you think the single should be. But
with all that said, we are finally away from our
initial record company, called V2, and the first thing
they said to us and the reason we signed with them was
because they said, "you make the records. We sell
them, and we don't make any decisions that you are not
comfortable with - ever." They looked at us and they
said, "you guys have been around for 10 years. We
respect that, and we like what you've always done with
your albums, but we think that you've been
misrepresented." That's all we had to hear. We were
like, "where do we sign." And they've been true to
their word. They came to us with a list of what they
heard as our singles, and we had a list of we thought
would work, and in the middle we had "Lickin'," so we
just went with that. It's been a very new experience
to have people know this. This is our band. It's
always been our band. This is the first time that
we've been surrounded by record company people that
see it this way too. It's nice when they realize that
they've got a ton of artists, we've just got us. We
know better. It's their job to facilitate what we
think and help us along the way. It's really the first
time in our career where we've truly felt that these
people want to help. It is cool. Hopefully it will
stay like that.

"Lickin'" has a different vibe, especially from Chris'
voice. Was that by design?

SG - Every song is just different. There's never a
concept with us. When we discuss what we want to do,
it's always thematically. That's so much more
important. We never sat down with a part and said,
"what are you playing here on the kick drum?" or "on
the second verse, what if the bass line changed where
you put the C into the." There's nothing like that. We
were just playing the songs, and if a take felt great,
that was it. We were focusing on the whole. I think
for Chris, a song like "Lickin'" just developed. Rich
started playing it, and we just started playing along
with it, and that's just how Chris sang it. It just
kind of happened. That's just how he sang it.
Sometimes it's really simple to be in this band. With
Chris, the first time he sang it is what you hear,
basically. It's not the same lyrics, but that's what
he heard. We were like, "yep, perfect." I think that
the longer we play and the older we get, we trust
ourselves more than ever before. There's not a lot of
over-analysis of what we are doing. If it feels right,
it feels right.

How much influence did the touring with Jimmy Page
have on the writing of this album?

SG - It had an influence on us in a sense. This is
weird. It was a huge influence, but not musically.
Getting together with Jimmy was such a perfect, once
in a career opportunity because we didn't have a
record contract. He was totally available. We didn't
have any obligations to anyone or anything. We weren't
even thinking about our next record, except for maybe
a couple of songs. This whole thing came together in
the fall of '99. We made that live record, but we
weren't thinking ahead of time, "let's make a live
record." It was, "let's go play these shows, because
we have a blast when we play with Jimmy." Literally,
it was that simple. It's a lot of fun, and he likes it
too. The timing was perfect. In the spring, when we
were actively pursuing a new contract, Jimmy called us
and said, "let's do some more shows. Let's do a full
tour." We were like, "well, yeah. We don't have a
deal. We're not sure who's going to produce our
record. We're not sure what company we're going to
meet with." The way he wanted to tour was to do three
legs, with a break of two or three weeks in between
each leg, which was perfect for us. We could tour with
him, make the record on the breaks. The year really
laid itself out to being conducive to having a great
time with him and getting our record done
simultaneously. What happened was we took the first
break, and he called and said that his back was messed
up. We knew he had a problem early in the tour. But he
called and said, "Look, I can't play." On one level,
there was disappointment, but on the other hand, we
had all this energy. The inertia was rolling from the
tour. There was no pressure on us. We were really
enjoying each other's musicality. These were new
songs, and we were looking at each other going, "hey
man, you're pretty good." It was nice. We were just in
such a positive headspace. Suddenly, the tour ended,
and for about five minutes, we felt weird about it.
Then we decided to just roll into the studio now and
make the record. Don Was, who we thought about making
the record with.Rich and Chris met him in LA and
played six tunes for him acoustically, and he said,
"yeah, I'll do it. Let's go." And it was done. We did
it then. We started working, and there was a
tremendous amount of energy that went into those
shows. The whole point of that tour was that it was
fun. To go into the studio with that mindset, coupled
with the fact that our new label was saying, "just do
what you want," just worked. 

That tour served as the ultimate slap in the face to
Columbia too, didn't it? It was your biggest tour
ever, wasn't it?

SG - It was the biggest in awhile. It was nice. I
don't get too worked up about Columbia Records,
really. We had no choice about being up there for one
record, really, the way the whole deal was set up.
That's all stuff that was out of our hands. We knew
that. We knew that was a label that understood Mariah
Carey. That's a label that is full of guys in suits.
There's no bones about it - they're all wearing suits.
They have an office on Madison Avenue. We went into
that experience going, "ooooh My God. If our so called
artist label never understood us, what the hell are
these people going to think?" BY YOUR SIDE was our
sacrificial lamb in that sense. We were like, "take
this rock record and let this deal expire quietly and
let us on our way." It worked out great, because for
the second time in our career, an option was missed.
Columbia was under the impression that we had another
firm album to go. We knew that we weren't. When it
became apparent to us that they didn't understand, we
just sat there quietly and said, "maybe they won't
pick up on it." So, seven months after the record hit
the stores, we were off and they didn't even know it.
We were so happy. The point to us was that we wouldn't
have made another record if it had to be with
Columbia. There wouldn't have been any point to making
a Black Crowes record. It really worked out nicely. We
informed them of that the day of the first show in New
York City in the fall of '99 was really very nice.
Like I said, that was a shotgun marriage that neither
side wanted anything to do with.

It was made for divorce from the start.

SG - If Columbia would have picked up the option and
said that we had to make another record, then there
would have been a lot of problems. 

How did TVT slide into the picture for the live
record?

SG - We didn't have a deal, so we could do whatever we
wanted. We did the internet deal first. We were
interested in doing that, because we didn't want to
bring a record company in. We had just taped the
shows, and the shows in New York and Boston went so
well. We had to do two in LA, so we just said, "let's
record this." We're thinking that down the road we
could do something with these tapes. We recorded it,
and it was a lot better than we anticipated. We were
like, "man, this is f*cking killer. We were on." It
was all from one night. The idea came to put it out on
the Internet. The reason that was so appealing was
because it wasn't a record company. We didn't have
someone going, "ok, let's set up a three month
promotional tour where you do interviews all around
the world, and let's get Jimmy and Chris into a photo
session." There was none of that crap. There was none
of the "let's cut the songs in half." There was none
of that crap. We weren't going to cut 22 songs down to
10. It was just, "how about this." The Internet
company took it, and it was available three weeks
later, with worldwide distribution immediately. That
was cool. We went into it with the notion - not me,
but our manager who thinks this way - that we would
have an option to do retail if we wanted to. Music
Maker was like, "cool. Just give us six months."
That's just protecting yourself against success,
basically, in case this thing went. Our honest to God
intention was to put it out there so that the diehard
knuckleheads could get it. Then, it really took off
around us. When Jimmy called us in the spring and
asked if we wanted to do some more shows, it worked
out perfectly for our schedule. We just looked at it
and said, "well, if we're going to do more shows,
let's put it in stores." It's so funny, because that
whole tour and experience started organically, out of
getting together for one night, and it just ended the
same way, with, "oh, my back hurts." There was no
concept, trust me. It just came and it went and it was
fun.

The Internet release was pretty cutting edge. You were
the first major band to release on the Internet, I
believe. Was that successful?

SG - It was the biggest Internet record ever, which is
not at all like saying that it's the biggest record
ever. It's funny, because people think of us as being
like Amish farmers who won't ride in cars because we
still play rock music, but too us it's the simple
equation of getting the music to the people quickly
and easily and creatively. We've always allowed people
to tape our shows. Anything we can do to make it
easier to get people to dig what we're doing is a good
idea for us. That's all this was too. We don't rely on
digital technology to make our music, but if it's a
tool it's a tool. If it's a crutch, then it's a
crutch. This is just another tool to get it out there
to people.

So does that mean that you are supportive to the
Napster mentality?

SG - I wouldn't say supportive, but I would say
apathetic. On the one hand, when we spent 10 years
giving as much as we can and being open about that,
and allowing people to tape our shows anyway, and then
seeing people come along and cash in on something that
we have no control over, it is initially
disconcerting. I will say that. But, the end result is
that if someone has never heard the Black Crowes and
they download 10 songs on Napster, I would imagine
that at some point they will go out and buy at least
one record. People still like to have the album. You
like to have the artwork. You like to have it in your
hand. It's not a bad thing at all. I know that's how
it works for my nephews, who are on that thing every
day. I have 16 year old nephews who are going, "have
you ever heard the Allman Brothers." I'm like, "Yeah,
where'd you get it?" And he says, "well, I was on
Napster." In that sense, it's great if it's opening
people up to music. It's funny, because with
musicians, there's this mentality of if you are
against Napster, you're not cool, or if you are for
it, you are cool. The thing I think is funny is just
wait until the technology gets to where people are
downloading movies before they hit the theaters. You
want to see the sh*t hit the fan. The music industry
is like an appetizer to the film industry. When
Hollywood starts getting ripped off, they'll take that
Napster kid and string him up from Time Square just to
make a point. They are going to destroy some people
when films start getting downloaded from websites. The
thing too about Napster is, look what happened to it.
BMG bought it. Every good idea ends up that way. The
labels just resist and resist, and then they go and
own it. It's light Lyndon Johnson. He voted against
every civil rights thing put in front of him for 20
years, then he gets in the White House and looks out
and says, "we shall overcome!" It's the same thing. He
goes down as the great civil rights president, that
cracker-ass Texan. 

How did this tour with Oasis come about?

SG - Just from getting to know them. Initially, we
were in London in '99 doing some shows, and they came
down to see us. Apparently, they were always big fans
of ours. They came to a couple shows. Musicians are
always like dogs. You sniff each other and you can
tell right away if you like each other. They came back
and were cool guys. Noel came initially, and like
anyone of our friends that comes backstage, he comes
in and goes, "what's that on the stereo." We just
talked about records for hours. We were like, "cool."
It's a nice place to start. We're the kind of band
that when we get ready to go on tour, we go, "ok, who
do we want to tour with?" It started from that day. It
was just, "we should play some shows together
sometime, or get some festival dates in Europe or
something." It's been in the back of their heads and
ours for two years. When we got our schedule together,
we knew the record was coming out in May and then some
festivals in June, and then we would start the US tour
in August. We realized that we had a month, and just
wanted to do something simple. So we just wanted to
see what they were doing. If they weren't available, I
don't know what we'd be doing. But it just worked out.
It was pretty simple.

So this whole "Brotherly Love" thing is a record
company ploy?

SG - No, that's not a record company ploy. That's us.
We think that's funny. No one at a record company
would think of that. The record company would bill it
as "The battle of 1812 All Over Again" or something
stupid like that.

How long are you guys going to tour?

SG - All told, for as long as it makes sense to. If
the record took off and we were selling tickets, we'd
stay out for a year. We look at touring as a chance to
just get to as many places as you can. I know we'll do
this tour with Oasis, a month in Europe, a week and a
half in Japan. We come home in August and then do a
tour on our own. If the record is really going and
there's a reason to keep going, we're there. We look
at the offers that we have, and if everyone is in the
right headspace - if we all feel good about staying
out there - then we will. That's how we always look at
things. We don't commit to, "this will be a two year
world tour." That's just no way to live. Beating a
dead horse is something that we've never been accused
of doing. We may pull up short of the finish line, but
we're not beating a dead horse.


Interview by Chris Akin for Harmody.com. Check out
Chris's website by clicking here.